Friday, February 02, 2007

City Hall Maneuvering!

Change isn’t bad, as long as you know what you’re getting. So the plans to scrap Thursday Committee meeting should be understood by all. It’s change that empowers City Staff far more then ever. Davenport will quickly become another Bettendorf, where the City Administrator and staff runs the show.

No you say! Not with this favorite alderman or that. And maybe short term, yes. But elected come and go, and at the end if the day it’s all about the process. I am surprised this is going thru with little concern.

Have a great weekend,



At February 02, 2007 6:29 PM, Blogger Dave said...

I've seen the presentation and heard both sides of the argument but I don't really see a huge difference. I can see benefits either way. It looks like you have a strong opinion.

Can you explain what you'd like to see instead? It looks like there are many other cities in Iowa that are currently following this schedule. The one benefit I do see is that this schedule will enable more people the option of participating more often. The 5:30 start times will also allow others to run for Alderman that otherwise wouldn't even consider it.

Help me take a stance.

At February 03, 2007 4:27 PM, Anonymous Conservative Democrat said...

So many things are hidden from the elected offical. The end up being responsible and the staff escapes the arrows.

This will not help rush changes that are often needed for Economic Development and Council approval.

If this passes we will see more dictorial things coming from the City Administrator. He should havebeen fired when we caught him with hands in the cookie jar.

This Democrat believes we need to go back to how the city was run under Ray O'Brien and those before him. The mayor was a strong mayor. He was responsible to the citizens. If he did not do it right, he was out of office the next election.

Stop this stupid effort. Legislature has committees, Congress has committees and we need committee. Down with the idiot Republicans and up with the people's party--Democrats!

At February 04, 2007 6:56 PM, Blogger cruiser said...

I can't believe more people aren't speaking out against this move. When Brooke tried it when he was Mayor it seemed there was a huge uproar. If people's main reason for not caring is that the public speakers are boors, we will lose free speach at these meetings. And that would be sad.

At February 04, 2007 10:07 PM, Blogger pioneer98 said...

I'm still not sure where I stand on this issue, but it would be short-sighted to take a stance based on whoever is the current city administrator. This decision will have impacts long after Malin is gone.

At February 04, 2007 10:37 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Conservative Demo here:

Let it be known that the "conservative democrat" posting above did not come from me.

At February 05, 2007 8:03 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

I don't feel this is a good change.
I have attended several Bettendorf meetings and it is obivous that the council members do not have a clue on what is going on in the city. Recently I challenged three council members on why they voted a certain way and they all said that is how the city administrator told them to vote. Why have a council if they can not review an issue and make up their own mind. The other thing is if you want to say something at the end of a meeting you have to be ready to get up and speak or they will adjorn the meeting and walk out. I have seen it happen. By the way - did Malin ever give his raise to charity or was it just another lie?

At February 05, 2007 11:34 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

I don't understand the argument that this is cutting anybody's time. It is my understanding that a person can still speak at least four times on any item (public w/business twice and when the individual item is discussed at two different meetings). If you can't make your point with four chances then maybe your point isn't very good. If it is an ordinance that requires three readings than that is 12 times to speak.

It also seems that there is more time between the COW and the CC meeting. The proposal allows there to be a week (seven days)of time to discuss issues with an alderman or staff person, whereas now there is only 6 days between the committee and the CC meeting.

Just seems to bolster the argument that those opposed are the againsters. If anyone from staff or certain alderman are for something they have to be against it. Period.

Four times to speak, more time to consult with staff and aldermen. It makes sense to go that way.

At February 05, 2007 11:49 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

To 11:34 I would rather have the againsters speak out then let the staff run the city to their own agenda, which is exactly what has been going on prior to the last election. I may not always agree with decisions that the Davenport council is making, but at least some of them are asking questions and challenging what is best for Davenport. Two much money has been spend by previous councils rolling over and saying yes and not asking is this really best for Davenport. I do not consider myself an againster, but is is also time that certain council members and staff start working for all of the taxpayers.

At February 05, 2007 1:23 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

How is four chances and 20 minutes of time allowing staff to run anything? Citizens can talk to aldermen anytime. Why do they think the only time it counts is when it is on TV? The againsters are having another knee-jerk reaction to something that certain aldermen want. That is the only reason. Winborn likes it therefore it must be bad because it is really Charlie's idea. (villanous music in the background)

The arguments against it are non-sensical and are refuted by 11:34. In fact, right now I can't make it to the committee meetings or the COW because of my work schedule. I'd like the meetings to start after 5 so I can get there and participate. If you want to have real conversation about real issues then have it. But to make paranoid claims that some small cabal are making all the decisions for the City and therefore change is bad, is ridiculous.

And go down the list - River Renassaince - 73% FOR (yeah I know they lied and cheated), Niky Bowles, - less than 30% of the vote against the evil Charlie Tuna; Susie Bell smashed by Cindy Winckler. Yeah everyone but the againsters are stupid in Davenport.

Move on people, streamline it. Why do we need to see the same people get up and say the same things six times on an issue (18 times if it is an ordinance)? Four is more than enough (or 12).

At February 05, 2007 1:26 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

I think the new meeting agenda is great! The public with day jobs aren't able to attend the meetings during the day hours we have now. There is still plenty of opportunity for public to speak, but at a time the public can actually be there.

At February 05, 2007 4:49 PM, Blogger QuadCityImages said...

I agree with 1:23 that TV plays too big of a role in when people want to talk. Sometimes you can get more done talking to individual aldermen then you can grandstanding in front of the cameras.

At February 05, 2007 5:03 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

This is really a good move, while their at it, how about limiting the toons from the mic. If the public input wasn't televised that would eliminate 90% of the cookoo birds that show up and use the Council's time venting and raging and foming about the mouth about additives and freezing water and whining about being a victim of some vast shadowey conspiracy.

It's no wonder Davenport can't get qualified candidates to run. Why would you want to put up with that sort of stupidity?

If Davenport would stop televising these actors they would get a new hobby or go to a movie or watch the sunrise with a cup of coffee.

At February 05, 2007 9:46 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

The ideas for change have nothing to do with public comment. That is a red herring. That is smoke. They are an attempt to give a few appointed committee chairs the power to set the council agenda and hold fewer PUBLIC meetings. Without committee meetings followed by a COW there is one less opportunity for the entire council to shape the agenda for the council meeting. In fact, the opportunity for citizens to impact the agenda would virtually be gone, as the time between COW and the council meeting is being promoted as their time to debate issues with aldermen. Well big deal; once the agenda is set at COW, as proposed, it's set. Good luck getting that changed at the council meeting.
I don't support letting 5 mayor appointed alderman set the agenda for 10 ELECTED aldermen.

If the committees don't meet, why have them at all? Or will they be meeting, this time behind closed doors, public need not attend?

As for the scheduling, gaining one day is inconsequential. If more time leading to the council meeting is really a concern here then hold COW on a Monday or Tuesday and Council on Wednesday of the following week. Don't patronize the public by saying uniform start times will be easier to remember. We've managed to follow the published schedule just fine. It's when the council holds special meetings, or works off agenda, without required legal notice that keeps the public in the dark. If keeping the public engaged was truly the issue, the city can improve it's observance of notification requirements. The state ombudsman recently gave Mr. Malin's staff a refresher course on just this issue.

Mayor Winborn is disingenuous to promote the proposed change for the public's benefit and yet doesn't put this critical discussion on a committee agenda last week. He pops up with it at the committee meetings with no notice to the public. And you want our trust, Ed.

Starting public meetings at 5:30 should be tried. More of the public could attend even if they don't wish to speak.

At February 06, 2007 12:08 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

On the surface, the proposed changes eliminate committee meetings. The real effects are 1) committee meetings open to the public are eliminated, 2) the committee chairs are given greater power to set the full council agenda, and 3) the committee chairs are given greater powers to control discussion by the full council. What’s being done away with is COW. It may still be called a COW, but it’s really a Committee meeting.

Forget the power point, or what you may have been told by the Mayor and those trying to ram this through. The political game book is the Council Rules of Order. Your chance to hone your public speaking skills or play to the home viewers will remain pretty much the same, but if you’re interested in impact, not just input, get ready to be castrated. Your alderman can be silenced and your concerns kept off the agenda. Those who set the agenda set the course of action and the agenda will be set by five mayor appointed committee chairs. That is half the number of aldermen elected to the council; and don’t count on one of the five being your alderman.

A sample of how the changes will work:
Currently, once posted, the agenda may not be amended. Agenda changes may not be made after the meeting of the Committee of the Whole except on suspension of the rules. It takes ¾ of the council in attendance to suspend the rules. (So whether it’s two days between COW and Council, or six, once the agenda is set at COW it takes eight aldermen to change it. Good luck with your impact, you’ll need that extra day. The proposed Rules limit the public’s opportunity to engage their aldermen before the agenda is set in virtual stone.)

With new Rules, Committees will not hold regular meetings. Should Committee meetings occur agendas will provide adequate time at each meeting for members of the public to speak. (No mention of notification for these probable committee meetings. Another words, you get the “time” to speak if you know there is a meeting, if you know where to find it, and if you know the agenda.)

Council Rules of Order with changes:

At February 06, 2007 11:42 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Wrong, wrong, wrong. Council rules now currently, and under the new rules, allow any council member to move the addition of an item to the agenda. It requires a second and 8 votes to be added. Not one of these motions have failed during this council's tenure.

The public can still speak on any item and at public w/business, two opportunities to speak on any item at the COW. They can do so again at the Council meeting. That is four times and 20 minutes. Your arguments suck if you can't "make an impact" in 20 minutes.

The misinformation out there fueled by the paranoia is unbelievable.

At February 06, 2007 2:53 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

I think paranoia is a misrepresentation of why people are concern with the change of the meetings. As 11:42 stated you can add an item to the agenda you just need 8 votes. Apparently you are not fimilar with this divided council. It would be next to impossible to get 8 votes - even if the item was best for the city. Too many self serving interest. The mayor stated last night that Davenport is the only city that is run this way. Who is to say that that is bad. If it ain't broke don't fix it.

At February 06, 2007 3:05 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

11:42 also stated that this Council has never (NEVER) not allowed an item to be added to the agenda. Despite their obvious problems with one another, no one on this Council is afraid to have an item added and debated. I do give them all that one.

At February 06, 2007 5:52 PM, Anonymous Joe American said...

Sounds to me that we have alot of councilmen visiting the blog and trying to win us over. Answering their own blogs with support. Take a look at the times at each posting. Smells fishy!

At February 06, 2007 9:01 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

OK Joe, enlighten us ignorant folks. What intelligence have you gleaned from the various times of comments posted?

At February 06, 2007 11:59 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

12:08 here. I hope the Col. Indulges me one time with this lengthy post. The references in my post to amending the agenda are taken verbatim from the current rules and are not proposed to change. Open the link on the City web page and at least read Rules 2, 3, 9.11, 9.12 and 35. What does change is the opportunity to affect the agenda by eliminating the current gap between the committee meetings and the COW. That gap between Thursday committee and Monday COW is essential to shaping the COW agenda because it is not subject to the 2/3 or 3/4 votes required during COW or during the full Council Meeting. Right now as long as agenda changes requested prior to COW are posted for the public 24 hours in advance of COW, the Mayor, the City Administrator, any committee chair or any two committee vice chairs can add items to the agenda. And they do it because of the discussions that now take place at committee meetings and having a few days afterward for everyone to react to the discussions. This is a good thing. This flexibility to alter the agenda after initial discussion will be lost if the changes, as currently proposed, are put through.

Amending a posted agenda, adding an item, or moving an item from the Consent to the Discussion agenda are separate and distinct actions with their own rules. Don’t confuse one with the others. Each has an implication on what is considered business, whether there is discussion, and whether an item gets an individual vote.

Now to respond to 11:42. You are right that any member can add an item to the agenda. But only during COW and the Council meeting and only if supported by 2/3 of the members present which can mean up to 7 aldermen. I find it incredibly hard to believe this is successful 100% of the time, but I don’t intend to comb council minutes to verify your assertion. Alderman Meyer comes to mind as one who tried to add an item and was outvoted. My reference to 3/4 (up to 8 votes) is a quote from the rules “Agenda changes may not be made after the meeting of the Committee of the Whole except on suspension of the rules”. Once COW takes place it takes ¾ of the members present to suspend the rules and change the agenda. Again, achieving this is not a slam dunk. The public needs the time before COW, and after initial discussion, to affect the agenda. Where I thing we also part company is that you see one side of the coin (adding an item) and I see both sides. Changing the agenda also means removing something from the agenda or changing the wording or its placement in the agenda. These things have happened; they affect the outcome you want to achieve. There is nothing so sickening as seeing an item put on the initial agenda too soon, without adequate discussion, then watching it come up for vote because it’s on the agenda and the sponsor wants to ram it through. (These Rules changes come to mind. Thankfully they were tabled. We got lucky.)

The public cannot speak on any item, but only those items on the discussion agenda. The exception is public with business. Being one who used public w/ business to speak because an item was on the consent agenda, not the discussion agenda, I can tell you the impact is not the same. The discussion agenda is where you want an item to be if you truly want to comment and have the council discuss. Discussion items also come up for individual votes so every alderman’s vote is on record.

Looking this closely at the Rules does not come from any feelings of paranoia. I’m pretty calm about it actually but I got your attention. The council and the public with business live and breathe by these rules. Attend a few meetings in person, or work with an alderman to get something of yours onto the agenda, and you’ll appreciate how important the rules are. Also recall recent attempts by the Mayor, the city staff, and some aldermen to circumvent the rules and the bitter repercussions of doing so. I am not opposed to change, but I do believe changing the Rules must be done with greater care and deeper understanding than what was attempted this past week.

At February 07, 2007 8:30 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

If you, or any citizen, want an item removed from the consent agenda so you can discuss it, ask any alderman and your wish is granted. You clearly do not follow council meetings or you would see that this happens at more than half of the meetings. The other issue you speak of are mostly motions to amend that Keith has made that did not receive a second. These were ideas so bad that even his comrades-in-arms were to embarassed to attach their names to and did not see any merit in even discussing. Adding agenda items have not been a problem. Also, if you read all the council rules you will see that prior to any meeting, any two council members (chair or not) can have an item placed on an agenda.

Your paranoia over things being changed are subject to Robert's Rules of Order and the amendment process during any meeting and are not affected by this particular change in the council process.

The length of your blast betrays your claim of calmness.

At February 08, 2007 6:34 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

It would be fun to see an alderman attempt to remove a finance committee item from the council's consent agenda at the Wednesday meeting, saying "a citizen requested it". We're talking removal here, not just moving it to the discussion agenda. Perhaps if I was the original petitioner it would happen, but not just any citizen. Aldermen do not carte blanche grant citizen requests for agenda changes; after all that's why there are Rules. While the track record of the council's 2/3 or 3/4 votes is of interest, we're talking about the process here, not assessing the current council's graciousnous. (is that a word??) The discussion is whether the process makes it easy or hard for the public's business and comment to come before the council. How aldermen vote after that is politics. If its important to 11:42 to back up their 100% claim I encourgage them to get an offical accounting of votes from the city clerk. The 2/3 and 3/4 rules are not accidental; they are designed to progressively stabilize the agenda for Wednesday night. Not a bad idea. It's because of these higher requirements for agenda turnover that make setting the initial agenda so vital. The proposed rules changes will degrade the public's impact on setting the initial agenda. I have read the council rules posted on the city website which I take to be a full set. 8:30 can do the readers of this blog, including me, a service if they can cite the rule number that says "prior to any meeting, any two council members (chair or not) can have an item placed on an agenda." -- I don't see it. Blogs leave tons to be desired when attempting to transmit emotion (or lack of) so I can only restate that I'm not paranoid nor blasting the keyboard. Calling a lengthy post paranoid is presumptuous. A deeper dialog on this topic requires a few more keystrokes. (the Col. seems willing.) This is not a sound bite topic but a technical one on a council document full of distinctions and in my opinion not that clearly presented in its current form.

At February 08, 2007 8:35 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

"we're talking about the process here," - Fine. Is it an unreasonable process for a person to speak on an issue at the COW, listen to the discussion and then speak with their ward alderman, the two at-large and the mayor over a 7 day period to hear the other side and attempt to persuade? Then you get talk about it again at the council meeting after having vigorous discussion and debate. Why is that not a legitimate, substantive process? I agree that is what we are talking about.

That seems reasonable to me. The insinuation in the other posts is that something nefarious goes on if there aren't three meetings to discuss something.

I have lived in many cities and in other countries, most local councils or boards do not have multiple meetings to conduct business and they seem to work just fine with minimal corruption.

If you want to talk process, if you can make a truly persuasive argument on an issue, there is no reason to have more than one meeting every two weeks.

At February 08, 2007 8:01 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Why does it seem like it is always something here in Davenport?

Atleast the QCRPA cooked thier own goose and we don't have to hear from them again.

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At February 09, 2007 9:05 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

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Most of the aldermen/alderwomen have telephones that accept calls from anyone, even a citizen, so the number of meetings seems secondary, except if you have to attend them and listen to the same story multiple times (one citizen made the same complaint at meetings 18 times before final action was taken, plus her buddies repeated it too). It still takes a vote to pass anything worth worrying about.

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